General Dahlia Chat 2023

blown_dry · 2023-02-04T23:41:17+00:00

Continuing from https://cubits.org/Dahlias/thread/view/91587/?offset=560#end_of_thread

blown_dry

Saw my first "wild" sprouts today: sprouts from clumps that over-wintered vs. tubers in pots that tend to warm up much sooner.

Krista

blown_dry I love the term “wild sprouts”! What an exciting day, I can’t wait for the business to go on an’ be outside finally! I’m afraid we’ve got a few more weeks of suppering with the dahlias on the dining room table still.

calico20hill

Indeed, we have commuter warnings for snow and ice tonight. I have some seedlings outside (but not dahlia seedlings ) and I could hear the hail rattling as it hit their plastic cover. THose should be sturdy little seedlings by the time they go into the garden!

WanderingDahlias

KitCMC definitely and cure a day or two.

Krista

I’m curious about the waterlily Fawn? Does anyone know it’s history and whether or not is has show or desirable breeding potential? Photo is from ADS OCG - I’m having trouble finding much online information or even many photos.

Teddahlia

Fawn; I read that it had nice cupping and so I bought it this year. Never seen it or heard of it prior to this year. According to my sources, four dahlias have been named Fawn and the most recent was a blend waterlily in about 2012 with no attribution as far as the breeder. endless12 is listed as source.
My tuber is in a pot and no sprout yet. I doubt my efforts will amount to anything as most older waterlies have crap for genes.

Krista

Teddahlia My research also resulted in numerous Fawns intro’d in different years, etc. I’m happy to hear you’ll be growing it this year and performing a hands-on analysis! My curiosity and FOMO motivated a purchase as well so I’m really interested to find out how it does and hear your feedback.

blown_dry

I would guess that "endless12" means that it was added to the directory because it appeared in the Endless Summer 2012 catalog.

SteveM

If I were going to hybridize WLs (for show or cut) I would cross two of the most recent WI introductions from Birch Bay with two of the most recent WL introductions from Hollyhill. It would be the lazy man's road to a winning WL.

Krista

SteveM I was wondering about this! Also wondering if it would be blasphemy to cross a brand new Hollyhill WL with a brand new Sandia WL? 😬

SteveM

Krista It is a good idea to build on the germplasm and efforts of the best breeders rather than starting from scratch. The best breeders are already a few generations ahead and often do not release their best breeding stock so would not consider it blasphemy.
Conversely, if I was breeding for new forms then I would cross unlike forms.

Krista

SteveM “It is a good idea to build on the germplasm and efforts of the best breeders rather than starting from scratch.”

When one ends up hybridizing a show-winner using two (for example) Hollyhill waterlilies, it seems not entirely fair to slap your name on it and gain recognition as the hybridizer. Even if it’s not based on the best of Hollyhill breeding stock. Is this how it works though?

Teddahlia

"...cross a brand new Hollyhill WL with a brand new Sandia WL?..." We have traded some stock with the Boleys and have a "breeding line " based on this trade.

Teddahlia

Boley vs Hollyhill waterlilies: They like shallow blooms with lots of cupping We like a full 7 rows of petals and the cupping is important too. We are breeding bigger flowers and trying for some smaller flowers too. The biggest difference is that some of our waterlilies grow much taller and 6 or 7 feet is not unusual. Not all are that tall as when we started with WLs they were not vigorous enough and it takes some generations to add vigor and plant height. Our tallest ones are over 7 feet tall but they are not yet released. We use a tall one for seed production and the seedlings of it are tall. Our best WL seedling of 2022 was well over 6 feet tall.

Krista

Teddahlia This insight into the differentiation between the two lines is neat to hear! Size is hard to discern from the photos online but I can see the more shallow form of Sandia Nocturne certainly. Hollyhill Daydream is aptly named, the delicate cupping and the rich color! Truly dreamy. This is the image from Madelyn’s Floral that captured me on Fawn - the blooms appear to be so full with a seemingly high petal count!

blown_dry

Krista If we stand tall, it's always because we stand on the shoulders of giants and all that. 🙂

Krista

blown_dry I like this a lot, yes! 🙌🏽

Teddahlia

What we do primarily is concentrating the genes that cause the various dahlia forms. People do not seem to understand that it takes many generations of breeding to achieve good form. And they think they can cross a Kenora flower with an AC flower and get a good dahlia. Even if the two flowers are the same form they probably got there by a different package of genes and would not be compatible.

Krista

Teddahlia Ah, so crossing Hollyhill and Sandia would be a venture that would begin years and years of breeding before results might be ready for Intro’ing. Sounds like you’ve already got the jump on this, I’ll get started on that Kenora and AC cross - we can regroup in a decade. 😂

Krista

I joined the PSDA in Volunteer Park today for weeding, edging, and marking rows for the display garden. This is the first time I’ve participated in any event with the PSDA and I met a handful of other members which was wonderful. When I mentioned my interest in learning about form and show quality, they told me about a judging class that I can take in July (possibly in Olympia, WA) as well as the online course offered by the ADS. I’m thrilled and will be looking into these! I’m looking forward to joining meetings with PSDA too, and becoming more involved. It sprinkled briefly on us today, but overall I had a really nice day connecting and chatting with more dahlia folk!

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