2024 Orders and Openings Chat

Juliarugula · 2023-08-01T22:12:46+00:00

I thought today might be a good day to start the 2024 thread, since I was browsing through the newly rolled over DahliaAddict site. Has anybody heard if Cle...

blown_dry

AndreaB Please don't be mad, but maybe we could give them the benefit of the doubt and assume they didn't expect dahlia fame or plan for it. All they can do is give people tips and tricks; it's impossible for them to meet demand. Most creators on social media keep delivering the content that people ask for, the content that brought them approval and fellowship. When you have ones or tens of followers, you can share your seedlings and your rarities and people love it and provide all sorts of positive feedback. There is no one that arrives from on high to tell people about the dynamics that change when you have x number of followers. And really, it's not their responsibility to manage the feelings of strangers. At the end of the day, I put the onus on "fans" to decide whether or not to consume content that brings them more frustration than joy. Some times it takes a few tries to get out of a toxic relationship, and that's what it is when people are in a relationship where they will never get their needs or wishes met.

AndreaB

blown_dry No worries, I’m not mad! I appreciate hearing other opinions.
You’re right, it’s not a farms responsibility to manage the feelings of strangers. But what happens when said strangers are unhappy? They go online to air their grievances. I cringe thinking about all the ugly discussions (post sale) last year.

The original poster said this farm was posting like mad. That’s hype in my book.
It’s their prerogative, but it’s not a marketing strategy I would choose.

blown_dry

Krista Thank you!

Juliarugula

Honnat Why do small farms out SOoooooooooo much into getting thousands of social media followers. So they can sell out in 4.5 seconds instead of 4.5 minutes? I'm actually wondering?

I mean, I’m old enough that this really isn’t my area of expertise…. But don’t the kids these days sometimes make money from social media itself? Like from advertisers and stuff if they have a lot of followers? I think that's a thing, right? The whole “influencer” deal?

So, not necessarily that these small farms actually currently make money like that (some probably do - Floret surely does), but I think the idea that maybe they could if they had a big enough social media presence is probably in the subconscious of most small businesses today. Everybody hopes they could be the next big social media star because that’s a whole additional income source in itself…. Plus, then you’re famous, right?

I mean, it sounds terrible to me, but I’m guessing that’s what drives the hype.

Why hype specific sales, with announced times and daily reminders? I’m not sure why that, other than just getting caught up in the dahlia sales whirlwind. I noticed that Chelan Butte stopped announcing their exact sale times after their website had trouble handling the traffic, so I guess some sellers figure out that hype isn’t all its hyped up to be, huh?

Juliarugula

Juliarugula (FYI, not speaking of River Merle specifically - I haven’t followed them at all and really don’t know much about them. Just talking about the tendency for small businesses to maintain a Very Active Social Media Presence in general)

blown_dry

Juliarugula Some accounts are monetized, but I think it's unlikely that farms are monetized. If suppliers don't announce a date and time, I am certain they are emailed constantly, wanting this information. I don't think it's fair to blame the farms for the hype. It takes two to tango. I mean, let's say the farm cut back access only to the customers they can supply. Now 98% of their fans have no access. Are they going to be happier with that customer experience? I doubt it. So, what are we blaming them for? I kinda feel like people are wanting farms to manage feelings and desires that we are in charge of managing. Benedict Cumberbatch is never going to be my boyfriend, but I don't expect him to quit making films. Genuinely sorry to come out with sudden strong opinions, but I have been watching this all play out from both sides for some years now.

Juliarugula

blown_dry Some accounts are monetized, but I think it's unlikely that farms are monetized.

I guess my point was not that most farms are monetized, but rather that social media monetization is just an ever-present undercurrent of running a business today. I think businesses don’t opt-in to the mindset - I think it just happens, and then they have to opt-out (if they want to).

I’m actually not particularly frustrated by dahlia shopping. Honestly, my favorite of all sales is the in person sale at my local dahlia society. Online sales are just little scatters of fun through the winter. There are very few dahlias where I can’t shrug and say to myself “oh well - gotta save some for next year anyway.”

It’s less that I’m cynical about dahlia farms and more that I’m cynical about social media.

blown_dry

Anyway, if people are frustrated. I know that feel! There's nothing wrong with that. If people see things they want super badly and can't have it. I know that feel. Those feelings are welcome here, as far as I'm concerned. I just don't think farmers are wanting people to feel that way or that they can be expected to prevent it. I do like you guys. Genuinely.

MIDahlias

blown_dry
I wonder what percentage of buyers are ready disappointed. How many people enjoy the hunt through societies, reaching out to other growers and going to shows? Trying to self reflect, I don't think I get disappointed when I don't get what I'm hoping for. I have some I have tried to get for a few years before I get them. It's sort of like gambling, pulling the handle on an old school slot machine. The only difference is, I don't lose money in a dahlia sale if I don't win.

calico20hill

I see so many of the younger growers getting into rooting dahlia cuttings and selling them, or selling the unrooted cuttings. I hope that will create more chances for some of us to obtain the new beauties when there aren't enough tubers for us. . My sweet neighbor is really into this and she says she has my back. We will see. I delight in her enthusiasm. I was able to buy some rooted cuttings at our Portland Dahlia Club meeting last year....there is another opportunity. I am quite willing to start with a cutting or a rooted cutting if I can't get a tuber. But tubers are more fun because I can make many more plants from them.

MissyWeitzel

Tough subject for sure. I see things from both sides of the fence. I get super frustrated with trying so hard to get tubers, then they don't even bloom true! That happened way too much to me last year. I would like to log my complaint about other sellers not keeping track of their cultivars! 😅

Honestly I'm medium active at promoting my business on social media and try to drive customers to my website and ultimately get them to add themselves to my newsletter list. People browsing my website gives me way more helpful business information than likes on IG posts do. I'm acutely aware that I don't own my very modest social media following and subscriber email addresses are far more important anyway. With that being said, I don't abuse my newsletter "privileges" because nothing drives me more crazy than businesses junking up my inbox.

There are so many more small farms selling tubers every year and in order to stay visible I feel like I should keep up on social media. I want to have longevity. I can control part of that by sending quality tubers, having great customer service, and offering what people want. I can stay on people's minds by being active online.

Sometimes I only have 10 tubers of a variety to offer and sometimes 100+. If the 10 tubers are my extras and people want them, why not sell them? For the most in demand stuff I put a limit of one or two tubers to try to share the love and it won't even matter that there were restrictions and many tubers because they sell that quickly. I reached my entire year sales goal in one hour this year, with hundreds of orders coming in the first few minutes. It is WILD and I'm a nobody in the dahlia world. I try to spoil my subscribers by dropping extra unofficial sales so they can hopefully get what has eluded them previously.

blown_dry

I often get feedback from users that are concerned that a farm with no social media presence may not be a legit business. I am recently on IG, but I saw that about DahliaAddict as well, that it was suspicious that I was not on social media. But anyway! To try and get back on track. I did get two from the CB opening without really meaning to shop. I'm pleased for the folks that got Venus. I've seen some gorgeous photos of that one. I got Aries and Mary P. I feel like Mary P used to be an 'it' dahlia, but now even slow-pokes like me may get it.

AndreaB

blown_dry Guessing your pic is Aries? I grew Mary P last year and really liked it.

KitCMC

AndreaB whoa, that’s gorgeous!!

Juliarugula

Cosey that’s a pretty thorough and carefully considered assessment. It’s like you’ve thought about this before or something… 😜

AndreaB I grew Mary P last year and really liked it.

Me too! What was your experience with vase life? I thought it was such a gorgeous flower, but it seemed to blow its center as soon as I put it in a vase. It was beautiful enough I’m giving it another chance this year and we’ll see if anything changes, but I’m curious if my experience was typical.

Honnat

Thanks for the discussion all! I'm really not upset at farms or tuber crazed customers. Do what you want! 🙂 I love following farms and seeing pics of varieties I'm thinking of growing. So if they all followed my advice, I wouldn't have much to look at.

What I really wanted was to open up a discussion on social media use. A few years ago I read a book "Digital Minimalism" and it was a good read. The author suggested people should take a step back from social media (or any media) and decide what they really want from it. Take a month off and then ask "What's my main goal in using Facebook or Instagram or ___?" Answer that and then decide how much time you actually need to spend with it to meet that goal. It's usually not that much at all.

So if a farm wants to promote his/her business to sell tubers in 2024; I would argue that they may not need to do all that much. But if you do....my feed will benefit. I don't really need any more tubers anyway.

Cosey

I'm not going to reply to any specific comment because my response is not directed at anyone. I think it's wild that the general public actively discovers and will plan to buy from a private farm. In every other area of agriculture I have experience this is a radical mindset shift and a fascinating market model. Building personal relationships and direct to consumer sales has been a pipe dream for farmers for decades.

That being said, you have to be really creative to even guess what the market demand is. There is no public market or commodity reports for tubers. Hobbyist and farms get one sale a year to see how things land. There is no test available to push the boundaries of a website during a sales drop.

Sellers can only manage what they can control. They can control their market to a degree. Some sellers choose to limit who they sell to. Some will not sell online. Others will create a (monetized) community. A seller can control pricing. Sellers can choose not to communicate with their customer base and silently open sales in an effort to avoid tech problems. Each one of these has positives and negatives.

I've tried finding a similar business model to the dahlia market and one does not exist. There are a couple of niche products (net worth usually 100+ million) that have a fanatic fan base but they can always manufacture more product throughout the year. They solve similar problems by spending a lot of money. Guess what? They still have checkout failures! They still have angry social media comments.

It's ok to feel disappoinment. It's a broken system on both sides. A seller will need to think outside the box and put themselves in a vulnerable place publicly to modify customer behavior and influence the market. If a seller were to step out and try something different they get one shot. Failure is more common than success when you try something new for the first time.

BarryO

Cosey
It is indeed a broken system.
If you know your inventory will sell out online in an hour or two, should you feed the frenzy by repeatedly announcing the sale date, time and offer strategies to secure the tubers you want? Sure, any seller has the right to do so, however well-intentioned. But isn’t that just stoking the fire?
On a slightly different issue, should a seller be applauded for selling a tuber for $40 or $80 or $120 ? Sure a seller is entitled to sell for whatever the market will bear. But in your gut, one probably knows whether should conduct is worthy of approval.

AndreaB

Juliarugula Me too! What was your experience with vase life?

Honestly, most bouquets I pick are gifted. I rarely pick them for the house because I’m always outside 😂 so… I’m not sure.
Did yours ever blow centers on the plant? I don’t think mine did, even late in the season.
Most notable was how tall this lady was. Since my garden is laid out by height, I try to determine an average from online info (I always default to 4 ft if I can’t find anything). Well, this one towered over my 4-footers and reached about 6 feet. Luckily it’s not a bushy style, so nothing got shaded.
It’s also an early bloomer and was still going strong with the late bloomers in October.
It checked all of my boxes and I’ll happily grow more of it next year.

Reminds me of an orange Hart’s Bonnie. Thinking about growing them together next year.

Juliarugula

AndreaB Did yours ever blow centers on the plant? I don’t think mine did, even late in the season.

Most of the flowers held well on the plant - they just blew when I cut them. Eventually I started just leaving them on the plant.

Most notable was how tall this lady was.

Mine, too. It escaped the netting and fell over about halfway through the season, though. Kept on going, as they do…

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