Hybridizing Dahlias

Bessie · 2023-09-14T03:43:02+00:00

Krista to discover if seeds are growing in the seed pod, after there are no remaining anthers on the pod, gently squeeze the pods between your thumb and fing...

MissyWeitzel

The weather has been crazy this season but what a difference. Hopefully future blooms are less weird.

Bessie

MissyWeitzel it's amazing how the growing environment affects so many aspects of dahlia blooms. I'm slow to give up on new varieties or even seedlings since I never know if I've tortured them to the brink of the current disaster bloom or growth. When I see a dahlia outperform despite the lack of ideal growing conditions, I pay attention. Those are the dahlias that may be resilient to a variety of climates.

Bessie

SteveM I'm sure I've already put Sweet Nathalie pollen on every likely dahlia match! I really like it and appreciate it's vigor and glossy green foliage. I don't like how it changes color with the cool vs. hot growing conditions. I like that KA's Cinder Rose has tight petals and the bloom position is better compared to Sweet Nathalie. I agree with MissyWeitzel , in that Sweet Nathalie tends to be clockface. I'm still tying to figure out what causes the clockface to occur( other than the obvious genetic component). My guess at this point is it happens when the plant is stunted in growth due to weather, water, or some environmental condition.

SteveM

MissyWeitzel Sweet Nathalie is always clock faced for me

Good info! Is it side-facing or down-facing? Side-facing is acceptable for cut but down-facing is not useful for anything. Even side-facing is probably not the genetics to keep around for breeding.

MissyWeitzel

[unknown] It is side facing. I haven't had any that were downward facing. As Bessie mentioned, it is a really healthy robust growing plant with awesome stems, great color, easy to store over winter, etc. Really the only drawback is side facing, and yes, it is still workable in bouquets. I keep saying I am going to cut it, but have kept growing at least 2 or 3 plants just to keep my stock.

MissyWeitzel

I have a question about pollen. If a flower is cut before showing any pollen at all and kept in a vase inside, will the pollen that eventually does become available be "mature" enough to be collected and used for pollination?
I tried kind of researching this question online but found conflicting information. I'm not sure if pollen maturity is actually a thing, but I'm willing to risk asking silly questions.

Bessie

MissyWeitzel I've used pollen from cut flowers. I believe the pollen is ripe when it's "fluffy". You'll even see it dropping from the flower onto the surface of the vase or onto the petals. I can't remember where I've read this, but some hybridizers pick a bloom that's ripe with pollen and use it multiple days for hybridizing. The bloom must be kept in favorable conditions that promotes opening up.
I've collected immature blooms that have broken off the plant and attempted to use the pollen. Only when the pollen is pushing out onto the stigma will the pollen be accessible. Inaccessible pollen that's still in the pollen tube is likely not ripe enough. Also, one more thought about pollen is although it only takes on grain of pollen to fertilize the floret, I think there's a thing of "pollen load" that when a large quantity of pollen is distributed on receptive stigma, there's a better chance of fertilization. I think I read that somewhere.

MissyWeitzel

Bessie thank you! Very helpful! I bought some little glass vials. I'm ready to try a little hand crossing this summer. 😊

SteveM

Do dahlia seeds need to dry/cure/rest before they are planted or can they be planted out-of-the-pod with success? Something I've always been going to try but never did and now I need to know. "Never put off until tomorrow an experiment you can do today."🙂

Bessie

SteveM in a few days I'll have my first "fresh seed starting" experiment results. I collected seed from a few pods that seemed ripe and immediately put them in plastic baggies with moist paper towels. They're being kept at about 80 degrees F.

Teddahlia

Elfin (picture)is a seedling of Mi Wong.

Bessie

24225 is a second year seedling that has been slower to produce a bloom(4") than it's almost lookalike seedling, 24232, that's been blooming for a few weeks. Hollyhill Daydream is the seed parent.

Teddahlia

I thought it was HH Daydream. 👨🌾

Bessie

Teddahlia just today I considered that the seed from the cross between 24225 x 24232 might make a really nice seed mix, considering how much they both resemble each other, and their seed parent Hollyhill Daydream. I think gardeners would want a nice dependable seed that produces pretty waterlily blooms.

SteveM

If I remember correctly, Dr. Hammett created a line of fully-double dahlias that came true from seed. I thought they also came true to color but I don't remember the percentages. I think he worked on these for several generations and the seeds were once offered for sale through Thompson and Morgan. I might be wrong on all the details so don't quote me.

Teddahlia

Margaret and I did a quick look at the 2025 seedlings and spotted a miniature formal decorative flower that has very nice form and a tight center(centers on miniature FDs and MBs are the most common defect). It is on a tall plant. I like tall plants. So I took it's picture(4 pictures) and I do not like flower in the picture. Usually, a very nice flower is just as nice or even nicer in a picture. The form is fine but the color is weird. I am going to let the flower mature a bit and take another picture. Perhaps you all find this post to be aimless chit chat. Dahlia breeding is full of "interesting to me" but maybe not to you things.

DarcyD

Teddahlia I have one like that now. It’s weird. Like the phone camera isn’t capturing it like I see it. It’s this one. I tried adding my hand to help color correct. I tried early. I tried late. I used different settings. I guess I need to break out my real camera.

Bessie

DarcyD it's so frustrating to not be able to capture the real color of a flower! Sometimes I'll change the focus point on the flower and it helps get closer to a true representation. Magenta and purples are the hardest for my Pixel 6 pro.

Teddahlia

2025 seedling of an unreleased breeding flower.

Bessie

Teddahlia genetics questions, if you have data... And wish to devulge the info. I know 0% about this trait.
Are you guaranteed the seedlings are variated like the parent? I'm really asking if the varigation is a dominant trait.
What about the % varigation of the result of a cross of parent x child?
What about the % varigation of the result of a cross of child x child?

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